Ep. 118: Spotlight - Kayla Dever and Samantha Winslow

In this spotlight episode, we have the distinct privilege to speak to Kayla Dever and Samantha Winslow of Every Dog Nosework about how they plunged into helping to build the Nose Work community in their area. This includes developing their training skills, competition accolades, hosting trials, workshops, seminars and more.

An amazing example of doers who are giving back to the sniffing community and sharing their love for all things Nose Work with many dog and handler teams.

Be certain to check out the various webinars Kayla and Samantha have offered through Scent Work University:

• Car Crate Crazy Webinar
• Geared Up for Success Webinar
• Harnessing Joy Webinar
• Tackling NW3 Head-On: Conquering the Mind Game Webinar
• The Floor is Lava Webinar
• Worth Waiting For: Leveraging Staging Areas to Maximize Performance Webinar

Speaker:

Dianna L. Santos

Kayla Dever

Samantha Winslow

TRANSCRIPT

Dianna L. Santos (00:00):
Welcome to the All About Scent Work podcast. In this podcast we talk about all things Scent Work that includes training tips, a behind scenes look of what your instructor or trial official is going through and much more. In this Spotlight episode, I have the distinct privilege of speaking with Kayla Dever and Samantha Winslow of Every Dog Nose Work, about the community that they have built in Michigan, all centered around Nose Work. Very good stuff. So before we start diving into the episode itself, let me do a very quick introduction of myself. My name is Dianna Santos. I'm the Owner and Lead Instructor of Scent Work University. This is an online dog training platform where we provide online courses, seminars, webinars, and eBooks, all centered around network. So regardless of where you are in your sniffing journey, maybe you're just getting started, you're looking to develop some more advanced skills, you're interested in trialing, maybe you already competing, you likely have a training solution for you. I should know a little bit more about me. Let's dive into the episode itself.

(01:01):
So in this episode, I have the distinct privilege of speaking with Kayla Dever and Samantha Winslow, all about the wonderful community that they have developed in Michigan, all centered around Nose Work, thanks to their work as far as creating Every Dog Nose Work, offering, trialing opportunities, teaching classes, and just making sure the focus is on the right things. So let's have a listen to that conversation. I want to thank you guys so very much for joining me. Again, I'm so sorry that we have to do this again, but I'm very so busy. It's good. But I do appreciate you guys spending some time with me today. We wanted to speak with you for our Spotlight series because both of you are giving back so much to the Nose Work community in your area, and it's just so incredibly special. Where to begin? Why don't we start with how you wanted to create something special in your area and what drove you to do that? So whichever one would like to start first, feel free.

Kayla Dever (01:54):
I guess I'll take that. So with Every Dog Nose Work. So really when I got involved with Nose Work, it was really at a transition point in my life of I was very actively heavily involved with the guide dog organization. It was service dog and guide dog organizations for more than a decade, puppy raising training, running large group classes for them, doing that site type of dog training. And then just life happened. I lost two older dogs back to back within four months of each other, and then some stuff happened there and then Covid happened, and it was just all kind of within several months of each other that all of that kind of trauma sort of happened. Boom, boom, boom, boom. And then I had done Flyball for 10 years and I had to retire my last Flyball dog, who is Brennan, my first Nose Work dog when he was eight from Flyball because the physical sport was too hard for him.

(02:50):
So there were these communities that I was very heavily involved in for a long time in my life that no longer were there. And I found Nose Work, it was something that we could all do during Covid, right? It was safe. We could do it from home. You didn't need a lot of stuff. You didn't need a lot. And there was online teaching opportunities. So we were able to take online classes and learn virtually without having to have exposure in person. And so one, I had a very talented gifted dog, which I didn't quite realize at the moment, but now that I've trained a lot of dogs, I realized that he was good at this and I could do a lot of mistakes and it didn't matter. But through that process, I just fell completely in love with the sport. I got all my dogs on odor.

(03:39):
I started really loving the training of it and just not even the competition side at that point was not even really a focus at all. It was just like, oh my gosh, look at how I can, our bonds are being hugely enriched and this is changing. My senior dog's lives. She was 11 when I started doing training with him. Brennan was going on nine, and I saw this almost puppy energy in them that I just hadn't seen in a long time, and they were fighting for their turn, my little shelter and Brennan who were both wallflower dogs, they'd be pushing through the pack to get to the door next.

(04:23):
I just was like, this is just amazing. As a person who really loves behavior science, it was so fascinating to see their world and starts being able to visualize how they show us their world with their body language. Like, oh my gosh, look at all of this communication that they're giving us that I was blind to, but now your eyes are open to it. And so that was kind of the head spur of it. But with that, as I was taking all these online classes, a lot of the online classes I was taking were showing NACSW competitions, and so I was seeing real world search areas in these amazing search locations. And locally, what I had available to us at that time were primarily CPE, UKC, some AKC trials. Those were, I started in C-WAGS and so it was training building type stuff. It was a lot of what I kind of call garage sale searches.

(05:21):
It's like we assembled these collection of things and it's an interior inside and we assemble that same collection of things outside and it's an exterior and there's a place for that type of searching. But I had a very talented dog who, and I was falling in love with the sport and seeing these amazing searchers. I'm like, oh my God, I want to do that. That looks like the real stuff. I want to get to that. And then I realized I was nursing, I worked as an oncology nurse and I was not taking any time off at all. I had tons of vacation time that I was not using because no one was going anywhere. It was covid. And I realized, well, there's really no reason that I can't travel. So I decided to go to my first ORT in Chicago, and that was kind of the jumping point. I'm going to go somewhere. That was the farthest I had ever driven for a dog sport, which is hilarious to me now because it was five hours away, so it was five hours away. I'm going to get a hotel overnight, I'm going to pay this money and I'm going to go to a venue I've never been to, and it was people I don't know and sniff boxes for a total of a minute.

(06:32):
And I was just in awe of the environment and the way they ran the trial. It was run such a smooth machine. Everything was, the dogs were so well cared for in that environment. And as a result of that, you are able to be a better competitor because you are not in that same pressure point environments because I don't have to worry about managing my dog through a whole cluster of dogs and I don't have to worry about managing my, I felt protected and safe in that space. And that was kind of like, oh, I knew I was going to like this, but I really liked this. So then I started trialing all three of them and very quickly was trialing. I had three dogs that I was moving through the level, so I was trialing all the time. And I realized that as I had this new exposure to these other regions where NACSW was the primary venue that this could exist outside of this venue because that same location in Chicago, where I went to it was For Your K9, so that's Nancy Reye's training location.

(07:40):
I had gone to a UKC trial there and it was still UKC, it was still run by the same parameters. It's still a leg based venue, but the care they took and how they ran it NACSW as far as we had a run order and I knew when I was going to run and there was appropriate staging and they had good understanding of set theory and odor and they had that education behind them. So I knew I was getting really fair clean searches and it just was like, okay, this can be, you can take this. I saw how areas that had a heavy NACSW presence, how that trickled down into all the other, the venues that were there and how people interacted with each other in those venues and how people interacted with their dogs in those venues. And guess what? Cleaner, fairer search areas and search and hides are a lot more fun to run when you're spending a lot of money and you get told no. And then they find later that there was a hide there and you're like, are you going to give me my money back? Are you going to give me a queue? No. Right.

Samantha Winslow (08:49):
Well, it also creates baggage too, right? You start to not trust that,

Kayla Dever (08:54):
Right? Yeah. Because you nos, right? And you're like, oh, my dog really looked like he was on something, but I didn't. So it was kind of all of that. And so I was really inspired by, I just was at that point just head over heels in love and super passionate and I wanted to help. I wanted to do something. I wanted to create that change in Michigan. I knew it was possible. I could see it in other regions. And I decided, I'm like, here's the thing, someone just has to do the work and I'm someone, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm a nurse. I've never run an event ever before. Even the group classes that I was running was through other organizations and I had never rented a facility before. I had never rented Porta-potties, catered an event, done all of the, built a website, got insurance, all of these things.

(09:51):
And initially it was overwhelming, man. I decided I was going to start with an ORT that was achievable. I'm like, okay, we'll do an ORT and we'll start there. And I had a site in place and then that fell through two weeks before. So I had to scramble to find a location, which I ended up working out better anyways, but you go through that, and then it felt like the first time I opened up the file, the Google Drive from NACSW that anyone can see, if you go to trials and how to host a trial, you clicked it open and there's like, there's so many folders and tabs and you're just like, oh my God, what am I doing? What am I getting myself into? And then I just like, okay, no, you're going to do this just one thing at a time. And it was kind of for a while it was you would finish one thing and behind every closed and finished task, lay 10 more and you just started again, but you made headway, right?

(10:48):
And that first ORT, Nancy Reyes and Jill Snyder, so the venue that I went out to, they both came to Michigan to support us and were our judge and CEO, because there wasn't anyone locally at that time, and they were super awesome to support that kind of early mission of we want to bring more this year and did a great job. But it's hilarious to me now after hosting, I don't even know how many trials we hosted, well over 20 to 30 actual individual trial days, but that first one was so overwhelming. There was so many things to think about. And now when I host an ORT, I'm like ORT, I only have to do one flow. Easy peasy. It's going to be the same flow the entire day, and it's only one search and it's boxes and there it is right there. Boom. There we go.

(11:35):
I don't even have to rent porta potties because we hosted middle school. So there's bathrooms there, but it just was really that passion project of I just wanted to make a difference in our region and I knew that someone has to do the work and I'm someone. So it was really just putting one foot in front of the other. And then when I met Sam on our Fenzi blind date at the Detroit Riverfront, when we found each other on a Facebook group for Nose Work training and said, Hey, I've been you. I do Nose Work,

Samantha Winslow (12:07):
Let's meet up January

Kayla Dever (12:09):
In January at the Detroit Riverfront, which sounds like a drug deal, but

Samantha Winslow (12:16):
A Nose Work deal.

Kayla Dever (12:17):
And we found a kindred spirit. I do believe one of my talents is seeing people and recognizing when they have something to give and tapping into that, and I think you have that talent too, but pretty quickly in that journey, I said, Hey, I'm thinking about hosting and I need something called a volunteer coordinator. Here's the file if you want to look into it.

Samantha Winslow (12:43):
And I was like, vc, what's a vc? I said, yeah, sure. I guess

Kayla Dever (12:49):
You just make sure that volunteers are doing what they're supposed to do. I had no idea what I was telling her. We made it up and bless her heart, she came along for the ride and she's been my VC every trial and I couldn't do it without her. And we've blessedly started to, we've got a few really good eggs that were growing, so that I think the goal is this fall, Sam and I might be able to trial together at one of our trials and we've got folks who are good and we'll steer the ship while we play for a day, which is really exciting too. That was not really the main focus of all of this, but definitely aside a bit of it, wouldn't it be cool if we didn't have to drive eight hours, 10 hours, 12 hours to go to a trial?

Samantha Winslow (13:33):
Let's do more here in Michigan and see if we can, oh, this would be a really cool place to trial. But we can't because hosting for vc, so it, it's actually nice to grow some of our folks to support us so that we get a chance to play just like we want everybody to have a chance to play.

Dianna L. Santos (13:50):
And I think it's just amazing what you've built in such a short period of time, the ability to take what you had experienced in other places and say like, wow, this is really well done, or this is really inspiring. And then be able to pick up that ball that was just laying on the ground. Anyone could have picked it up, but you were like, I guess I'll pick up this ball and I'll try to play with this ball a little bit. And it probably hit me ahead a couple of times, rolled away and Jad after it and it was like, oh my God, it's going down the hill. But then you able to figure it all out, which is

Kayla Dever (14:20):
Incredible. It's more like a snowball. It's grown a lot. Yes, you pushed it down the hill and like, oh my God, suddenly it's like 10 times the size that it started and I'm what is happening?

Dianna L. Santos (14:34):
But I think it's just so incredibly, I hope that the two of you can just pause every now and again and just take in what you've done because it is very impressive. I love the way that you were describing this Kayla of, I had no idea what I was doing and I ran into this, but it's impressive that you are an event coordinator. You are a planner, you are secretary for all intents and purposes. You're a web designer, all these different hats that you're trying to wear to do this one thing of these people just coming and playing with their dogs and you're like, oh my God. On top of having a full-time job that's very demanding on top of trying to do things with your own dogs. For the both of you, this is amazing that this isn't the only thing that you do.

(15:16):
You didn't go to college to do this. You didn't take an internship for 10 years to figure out how to do this. You just was like, Hey, we want to offer this opportunity in our area because we're really passionate about it and we're going to do that. That's amazing. Truly. That's incredible. And the fact that you've grown it to where it is now where every dog, Nose Work is a recognizable name, you have done some wonderful fundraising events with your shirts where you now can see people wear those shirts. Oh yeah. It's all over the place. It's amazing. I

Kayla Dever (15:46):
Remember the first, so that was, I knew some things that I had observed good businesses do well, and I knew one of the things that I really wanted was brand identity, and I wanted it to be a part of the community and the mission that we wanted to create. And so that was why when I was looking at names, every dog knows work. It came early and it stayed the contender and was up there because that really was part of what I still really deeply believe is that this sport is for every dog. And it doesn't matter if you compete ever, but every dog can benefit from having this game in their lives. And so that was a big part of that. And then I have a friend who is a graphic designer and she did an amazing job doing my initial logo. I knew I wanted a clean logo that was recognizable that would stand out, and it does have my sniffy boy Brennan, who started it all, but generic sniffing dog.

(16:55):
It's clean. And then we keep that one in our shirt designs each year. So we've tried to, the very first shirt design was Nose. Work is for every dog. And we had a little chihuahua and a Doberman and Little my lab and then a little Corgi on Wheels who's inspired by a real searching dog that I met on my travels doing Elite. Her name was Daisy, and she went all the way to Elite champion, and most of that Elite, I think all of her Elite journey was in a wheelchair, which is really awesome. So that was kind of the first one. We did that and we used that money to help us grow, right? Because guess what? This wasn't a business. This was my own money initially saying I'm going to, and the first venue I rented was a baseball stadium in Traverse City, which is four hours away from us.

(17:44):
That was our first trial site. So I was like, okay, I need that nurse buddy is not, it's there, but it's not like this yet. That helped us. And we did fundraisers for score room leads. I recognized as I was looking through everything, I'm like, oh, this is a real need. There are no local score room leads here in this area, and this is a real important job. You need this one person's specific skills. They train for a lot of trials. They're very dedicated people. You need very organized, very on top of it, people who are okay and comfortable with not being in the limelight, not being the person who is getting attention for really giving their whole day up. And I did advocate. Now they are paid, but it's not, I mean, they get $150 a day plus their travel expenses.

(18:37):
They're doing this because they are passionate and want to get back to the sport as well. So we have some of the fundraisers were to support people who wanted to become score room leads because whenever they're in that training process, they're traveling on their own, they're paying for their, I'm going to go to train at that trial and I'm going to pay for my hotel and that. So we've used some of that to help support some folks who were doing their score room lead training. And then we've kind of each year done a shirt that's kind of continued with those themes. So we did the bigger, small find them all. So we had big dogs and little dogs finding things on different elements. And our current shirt design, which if you go to our page now is inspired by something that I said very flippantly. It just was obvious to me when I was on my Summit journey with Brennan was dog first team, second sport third. I was just like, well, yeah, obviously that. And someone just took that out and was like, that's really great. And I'm like, oh, I can make a shirt out of that. So now that's our current shirt that we're using for fundraising, but it is unreal to travel to far away states and see people I don't know, and they're wearing every dog Nose, Work shirt. It's like, yay,

(19:50):
Well shirt.

Dianna L. Santos (19:52):
I think that these are all just really great examples, what both of you have done as far as the kind of culture that you have cultivated, not just in your area, but how that's permeated and how that's spread, the way that the conversations are held, the types of photos that you see shared around. Again, the fact that Sam, that you are the VC for these, you have a really big role as far as for that trial, how you're helping those volunteers. And particularly if you get someone like a deer in the headlights, I decided to volunteer, but I don't know what I'm

Samantha Winslow (20:22):
Doing. Yes, and you know what? And I fully support them and I like when people step outside their comfort zone and join in and I say, listen, we're going to make it super simple for you. I try and I think about, so I go back to my medical education background where I want to set up that learner to really understand what it is they have to do. So you have visual learners, you have ones that can just hear ones that need a lot of movement to learn. And so even when I'm giving that information, so these are what your tasks are today, we do that walkthrough and I'm thorough and I've done the walkthrough several times, the visual learner, and then I make sure that they understand what I'm saying and then I ask them to repeat it back. So I really set them up so that they feel confident and comfortable to be able to run that role.

(21:14):
And it's quite amazing. Our volunteer team, people volunteer over and over for us and they fully support us, and I feel fully comfortable knowing that they know that task. So if I say, okay, so these are your tasks for this group, they will tweak it just a little bit for themselves to make sure it flows well. So I give them that autonomy, but I don't throw 'em into the deep end, Hey, you just do this. I say, do, this is what we're trying to do. And then with themselves, they talk amongst each other. They may not know each other, but they feel comfortable to talk with each other and be like, okay, well I'm thinking this. And then usually what they've decided is perfect and it flows wonderfully. And I come by and I'm like, what are you guys doing? Oh, well, we're okay. Good.

(22:01):
It's working great. Wonderful. And then I go to the next team. So sometimes I want to jump in and be like, that's not what I said. But no, actually it's working nicely. They understand what the needs are for the competitors and understanding to support them fully. And some people just want to be like a stager. They really like to be right there. They don't care about watching the dogs. They're like, I just kind of like s seeing the dogs walk up and talking to the people. It's great. I love our volunteers. We have a wonderful base of volunteers and then people that I don't even know will sometimes volunteer. I'm like, Kayla, do you know who this is? And she's like, no. I'm like, well, I don't know who that is either. And they'll say, I don't really know what I'm doing. Oh, no big deal. Great. We're going to have a script. Don't worry about it. You're good. We feel so confident now with our team is that we give them a little extra tasks. We have one person running the flow of the numbers, our app or on the website thing to help people going. They feel comfortable to do that, gotten the right instruction and they understand what we need.

Kayla Dever (23:03):
A big part of what I knew was going to be important to the success of having a lot of trials in our region. I traveled to a lot of different regions and while I was trialing a lot, I did try to volunteer as often as I could in different regions. And you'd learn a lot. You'd see some things you really liked and you're like, that doesn't work. And you could kind of pick what is, and I'm very good at when I'm at a trial and I volunteer all the time and I'm like, not my circus. These are not my monkeys. Tell me what you want me to do and I will do it and it will. But some things that I knew was going to be really essential is I'm a registered nurse. I worked during covid, I've been a nurse for almost 10 years now.

(23:43):
I know that when you undervalue essential workers, you're kind of screwed. It is vital to treat your volunteers very well and to make sure that they feel very appreciated and want to come back. Because if I'm hosting five to seven trials a year, that means 10 to 14 trial. Actually more than that because a couple of our trials, we do three day trial weekends. So we're looking at 15 to 20 individual trial days a year that we're running and that we're asking a team of 10 to 14 people to give up their day to support us and not make money. Sometimes

Samantha Winslow (24:20):
Travel

Kayla Dever (24:21):
And sometimes travel. When we go to those sites that are not local to us, we have volunteers from our crew who are friends and volunteers who will travel and stay in a hotel so that they can help us at these distant sites. A big part of that is really making sure that we really paid attention to respecting that role. So we created volunteer worker books. So every trial day that a person volunteers, you get 15 worker books that can be used for any EDN, anything. So if we do a seminar, if we do class for our students, two volunteer days for our students, gets them a free class in person class with us, if you only do a half day, you get $5, but you get something back so that maybe if you are not local, you came down for the NW3 from Minnesota, but you'll stay an extra day.

(25:08):
Guess what? The next EDN trial you come to, you're getting some money off because you've stayed an extra day and you volunteered. And so that's a big weight. I think how you value people is with value. And so that's a part of it. We do nice volunteer gifts every trial they get. We like our EDN swag, so they'll get a nice bag or a mug, and it's a way to kind of continue to support that brand identity, but make sure that people feel valued and they're all excited, right? This last round we did beach towels for towels. They're big beach towels. They're so bright orange and they have the big logo, huge. They're so awful looking, but they're like, great, and they're the perfect car towel when

Samantha Winslow (25:52):
You're leaving the car and dry your dog when you're in the lake.

Kayla Dever (25:55):
So that kind of stuff. And then making sure they have a good lunch, making sure that they get a good lunch, they get a full lunch break, all of that kind of stuff is really important to doing that. And then another thing that I think as far as just a tip for hosts that I think people don't think about, we use signup Genius for our volunteer signups. So if you go to our website and go to trials, you can see the volunteer signups on those pages. I almost never anymore have to ask for volunteers because people can go and they know that we're hosting trials, our community is rich and is growing. They know we're hosting trials. They can click on that link and they can see what we need. They can see if we're full that day and we don't need help, or they can see, oh, I can actually volunteer either day, but it looks like you need me on Saturday. So I'll volunteer on Saturday and it takes work out of it for me and for her. We don't have to go scalping for people. It's done. We have a trial coming up in August. We're full right now with volunteers. I have 14 volunteers both days. I have vehicles, and that's huge. I can't, yes, we are the dreamers and the doers and the people who are making this happen, but we could not do it without that team and that help, and that's a really important piece of this.

Samantha Winslow (27:10):
No, because it would add stress of like, okay, now we have to combine jobs and then a new person coming in, that's really overwhelming to have all these jobs combined and then try and do that, right? Or

Kayla Dever (27:23):
You're going to want to volunteer whenever it's a thousand degrees, you've been outside the entire day, you don't get any break at all. No one breaks sure that you have water. No one tells you thank you. And then you're also doing three jobs and at the end of the day, it's just done and that's it. And think you're good ridden. You're like, am I going to feel like I want to do that again? Maybe not.

Dianna L. Santos (27:49):
It's a testament to what the both of you have done as far as the thought process you've put into this, the approach that you're taking and the care that you have towards the three parts, the dog, the handler, the team, but the community as a whole as far as the people as well, and how you are changing the dynamic of how everyone is interacting with that little ecosystem. And that it's not just about trialing because that also can then bleed over into our classes, into our practice sessions, into how we think about this wonderful activity of Nose Work and playing the sniffy game. That it's not just about competing, that it is about the game. It's about really honoring our dogs and seeing our dogs and being able to think and talk about it a little bit differently where it's not just like, so what did you earn at the trial? What did you earn at the trial? It's like, it's not all that.

Kayla Dever (28:40):
My favorite brag post to see are not ribbon photos. They're people who did not title, and they're talking what I learned, what they learned, or what a fun day they had. That is by far my favorite brag, brag post is, well, we didn't get a title, but I learned that my dog was amazing or I had such a good time in the parking lot or whatever. That's by far the best.

Dianna L. Santos (29:03):
And that's something else that the two of you have done such a wonderful job with because it can be very difficult to try to fight against just a human ego. But you have done a really wonderful job and hoping you both can talk about this. There's signage. First of all, there's lots of clarity as far as where you need to go. Colors so many colors and there's directions, and then there's so much stuff. So can you talk about that a little bit?

Kayla Dever (29:28):
Yeah. So we talked about the volunteer side of this, but really we really wanted to create an ideal competitor experience. We want to the competitive aspect, there's enough stress without adding anything. Just the idea of paying money and showing up and being tested is stressful. And so you take in, I think there are things that people think flippantly, like, okay, you shouldn't have to do that. You shouldn't have. These are adults, you should need to do that. And it's like, okay, well one, I think you're just showing that you don't compete that much because I can tell you that I emerged from a fog at a trial. I got the site, I do the walkthrough, I set the flow, I knew where my flow was, and I called finish and I started to go out the wrong door.

(30:22):
What's happening? They're like, over here this way. I'm like, right, right, right. Yes, that is what I was doing. And so as a part of that, we want to make sure that we're creating a successful, easy environment and low stress environment for the handler. So we have very clear signage from the road to here's the potty area, here's the competitor parking your entries. We have a wonderful parking lot app that was developed by Jen and Dave McClusky from Red Huskies in Maryland. They do sell it to other hosts, and it's really reasonable, like $75 a year. And it's not super functional for anything that does not have two flows and one run order. But for any CSW, it is excellent and we are able to use that app and they design it for you. So they designed, I told her, I said, I want blue and orange kind of our colors.

(31:20):
So we go with that. So there's a blue side and there's an orange side. And so hey, guess what? When your number's up on the blue side, you're going to follow blue cones to get to your search. When your number comes up on the orange side, you're going to follow orange cones because guess their science says that we remember colors better than numbers or anything else. That's easy. I can remember colors. And then we consistently use, we say you're going to follow the yellow brick road yellow cones home. So any exit, if you find yellow cones, follow them and you will get back to the parking lot. Is it perfect? No, there will still be someone who somehow manages. I'm like, how did you even get back there? I didn't know that there was an exit that way or anything, but by far we're able to do that.

(32:06):
And also a big part of that is having enough volunteers, could I make more money and could we have less expense if we did not basically give $50 worth of money or gifts to every volunteer and make sure that we have at least 10 on any given trial day? Ideally, 14 is the number I like because more volunteers means that you have support at every step of that way. We have an exit director whose job it is just to, Hey, over here, you're coming this way. Follow these here. And I can't tell you how many times I've been told by competitors how helpful volunteers were, how kind everyone was, how totally set them at ease because they didn't have stress about anything. Literally, you followed your color dots and someone got you everywhere you needed to go and was looking out for your dog and making sure that your dog stayed safe in that environment and all of that, right? It doesn't mean it's perfect, but it definitely, having that intention with all of it is really important.

Dianna L. Santos (33:16):
And Sam, did you want to talk a little bit about the other types of signs, the little mottos that people are able to see? Those are definitely the photos that you see shared around on social media.

Samantha Winslow (33:24):
Oh, yeah. So we have a lovely little poster that we made with a quote pretty much saying, remember, this stays a gift to be with your dog and cherish it and be in that moment. And it reminds people just to be in that moment with that dog because sometimes our dogs live short lives and there's things that happen and they leave us suddenly without us expecting it, and it's heartbreaking and tragic, and sometimes we wish we had that one more day. And so it is a great reminder for our competitors and our community to know that you know what? Stop and have a moment with your dog. This dog is so amazing. You're able to go search with this little other sentient being that you guys don't speak English together. You have your own language together, and you've built that relationship and you move to do these exciting things and people don't remember that day to day.

(34:26):
And then you're like, oh, wait a minute. Yeah, that's so true. That is so true. And then to see the lengths at what we go to support our dogs to become amazing, the dogs that are reactive, the dogs that are sensitive, the dogs that are blind, those dogs that we we're joining together to do this fun game together. And you can do it. It's just amazing. So by having a poster and having our beautiful, and I'll talk about the no-nos raffle, reminding people to just be here now, be in that moment with your dog because life is short. Even be here with your other fellow competitors. It really is just amazing to be together.

Kayla Dever (35:04):
I'm going to interrupt you for a second because I found it so literally, it's like it's big. You see the sign, it's a big,

Samantha Winslow (35:11):
We're like, you should see us hanging it up. It's not seriously

Kayla Dever (35:16):
Large. Yes, it's

Samantha Winslow (35:17):
As tall as us.

Kayla Dever (35:18):
Yes. It says, always remember the time will come when you would happily give back every placement, every ribbon and every title, just be able to walk with your dog to the start line one more time. This is a game. So live in the moment with your partner, make memories and have fun with your best friend. And so that's at the entry of any of our trials, what's important people, and yeah, talk about the no-no wrap. I think that's a big part of the culture too.

Samantha Winslow (35:39):
So one of our wonderful students, she was like, oh, you know what she saw at a trial, I think it was at Laura Barlow that had the no-nos,

(35:46):
Lori Timberlake, Lori Timberlake Lori Timberlake had the no-nos raffle. And she was like, that's a great idea. So when our trial was hosted at host, this host student of ours and great friend at their facility, at their place, we rented their place to do a trial. She put these wonderful little notes all over reminding people as they're going in the door, remember, be in the moment. And so she was reminding people about just that, but then she did this nice long letter of just look at it as like, no is not the end. No is actually somewhere where you can continue to learn with your dog. And it's just so wonderful that we actually have that up too at the rest of our trials when we try and do a little raffle so that people feel encouraged to turn in that no, because it really isn't. No, isn't terrible. It's just I'm still learning, right?

Kayla Dever (36:44):
You call it the No, I'm still learning raffle yes, instead of no-nos. And so it really is so great because we've all been to trials where it was tough for X, Y, Z reasons, and it's like there's a black cloud in the parking lot and everyone looks mad, and it is just like, and we recently hosted an NW3. There were a decent amount of titles, but definitely people, it was challenging because guess what? NW3 is hard. And there were people who got nos, but I would see people and they'd be like, oh, I said, how's your day going? Oh, I've got an entry for the no raffle, but we're having fun. And that is just such a different feeling than the alternative. And another important part of it, and I think it existed before we developed it, but it definitely has helped, I think positively reinforce this.

(37:42):
It bums me out whenever people leave when just because they are out of the ribbons, you think, oh, I'm not going to get titled today or XY if you got to leave for other reasons or your dad's having a hard time, that's a different story. But I've been to trials where everyone more than half the parking lot is gone by the time ribbons are happening. And I think it's just part of the community aspect of this, and the sportsmanship of this is supporting each other and celebrating each other's wins. And so with this, guess what, it is rare that we have people missing at our award ceremonies. Most everyone is there, right? There might be one or two who had to get on the road early and usually they say bye and thank you and they had a great time. And you'll see you later for every single name that's called. It's a loud round of applause. Oh yes, everyone is smiling and engaged and happy for each other genuinely. And that is just awesome to see and witness and be a part of.

Dianna L. Santos (38:46):
And those are the exact types of things that honestly is needed in all dog sports. But even just things, dogs, we need to remind ourselves that we all love dogs and we're passionate about our dogs, and we have so much more in common with each other and we can be celebrating one another as opposed to, oh my God, well you have a red shirt. Oh my God, well, you have a blue shirt. All that stuff. We don't need that. So I think that it is amazing what you guys have been doing as far as just on the trial front, what you've been growing with this community, and it has been spreading because people may travel to your trial and be like, this was really cool. And they kind of take all that goodness and they bring it back with them. So it's kind like a little spreading of goodness everywhere.

(39:28):
It's fantastic. But you also do this. It's paying it forward. Exactly. And I think that it's such a big testament to the both of you because it is hard. It is a lot of work. It's a lot of attention. It's a lot of wear, but it is so incredibly rewarding and you can see that benefit almost immediately, which is fantastic. But you're also doing this on the teaching side as well. So do you both want to talk about that a little bit? Because again, I think the fact that you're benefiting the community in all these different sectors is so incredibly impressive. And as a fellow colleague, I think that it's awesome that you are so supportive of your fellow colleagues and that you're also cultivating this idea that we should be partnering with each other instead of being like, oh, you're a competitor

Kayla Dever (40:11):
Within our teaching community. So as whenever I started teaching and then kind of took Sam on board and we started hosting classes, Sam and I both come from very similar places and backgrounds with positive reinforcement based training and very intentional teaching. I have a tag teach background doing medical education. She has a lot. It's very important for us to support our learners by having very, very purposeful training. We're not just setting sniffing GOs for classes. Our classes are purposeful when you come to class that you're going to learn something, that there's going to be, we have actual focus things that we are working on that are continually developing our teams is a big part of just how we are and who we are as instructors. I think as our knowledge grew, just by us taking classes online and by expanding our knowledge, traveling, trialing, competing at high levels, we quickly became one of the more experienced instructor teams in our area.

(41:19):
But it was very important to me to make sure that we fostered and continued to foster our relationships with all of the instructors that we're currently existing and training within our community. Because this sport is for every dog. And guess what? There's a lot of dogs out there, and no one person, none of us can possibly meet the needs of this growing sport. It's impossible. Even if we did not, if we did not work full-time jobs aside from this, there's no way we could meet the demand that it has continued to grow. And so we need other instructors. We are not competing with each other. We can support each other. I can send, if you are good at this or my person, I've got a person who's asking for classes and they're closer to your area and this is better for them. I'm going to, we are very willing to share all that.

(42:13):
This week I'm doing private lessons with a student of another instructor, and whenever the student approached me about privates, I contacted the instructor and said, Hey, your student is asking me about privates for these issues. Do you have any insight into any of this? She could give me a little bit of her information. I said, great. And she said, awesome. Let me know what your feedback is, and we're able to collaborate. And I think there's a saying that competition happens at the bottom and collaboration happens at the top. And that is, that's important. And so even whenever I just started having classes in our area, and when I started hosting in our area, I made sure to tell everyone who all of the other instructors that were immediately my area, any other hosts that were within a region that, Hey, these are the dates that I'm looking at.

(43:03):
I don't want to compete with you. And I think some of it is, Sam and I are both of a different generation than a lot of the folks who participate in dog sports. I'm in my early thirties, Sam's their forties. We have a lot of older women who are competing and trialing and unfortunately have a lot of baggage of mean girls and women feeling the need to be defensive and feeling like you're threatened and all of that. And I think it's just not necessary. You have things to teach me. I may have things to teach you, but ultimately who we are benefiting is the dogs and the people who interact with us. And so I think one of the ways that we have really, I think that something that I'm really proud of and that I think is one of the ways that we are able to have the biggest impact as instructors within our Nose Work community in Michigan and improving the quality of instruction and the opportunities available for people in our area is that we have quite a lot of instructors that teach at other locations or within our immediate vicinity who either take classes with us with their own dogs or come to workshops, do seminars, support things back and forth, come trial with us, volunteer for us, and we are all part of the same team.

(44:42):
And so I'm continually honored by that. They won, think I have anything of work to give them, but two, that they're willing to be a part of that community and not feel threatened by it. It's really awesome.

Samantha Winslow (44:58):
Well, I think even having them feel comfortable and being welcoming, like, no, come on. And then you can talk about, oh, well, I saw this. I saw that. You can collaborate. But it really is, like Kayla said, is an honor to know that we have set the culture or set the atmosphere of them feeling comfortable,

Kayla Dever (45:24):
Like a culture of safety, knowing you're safe here.

Samantha Winslow (45:28):
We don't have to worry about, oh, I'm going to enter that, go to that seminar, go to that thing that they're hosting. They're welcome and they're comfortable with doing that. And I feel great that like, oh, good, I've made them feel safe that it's not going to be like, oh, well, they should know this. No, no, no, they should. Right? None of that.

Kayla Dever (45:48):
Yeah, none of us knew anything at some point,

Samantha Winslow (45:50):
Right? Exactly.

Kayla Dever (45:51):
Right. You're all new somewhere. And guess what? There's,

Samantha Winslow (45:54):
We're still learning.

Kayla Dever (45:56):
One of the, I think biggest red flags as when I'm looking at, I'm looking for instruction. If you think you know everything, immediate red flag, if you don't have a curious nature, if you are not constantly looking to improve your process, if you are teaching exactly the same way now that you did five years ago and you've made no evolution at all, I'm suspicious, right? I don't teach remotely the same way I did three years ago. I've learned so much in that time. I wasn't doing anything wrong then, but I've learned a lot since then and I hope that I'm doing things different in three more years. I think that's a big part of it as well. But also, we have a friend who's a local instructor and who is working to start hosting locally within our area, doing some trials herself, which is awesome. And I've had people, are you worried about that? And I'm like, why would I be worried about

Samantha Winslow (46:56):
That,

Kayla Dever (46:57):
Guys? What this could mean is that I could sleep in my bed, I could get up and I could go trial a dog and I don't have to do any of the work, and it could be less than an hour away, less than an hour away guys, and I could go back and sleep in my bed. Why would I be worried about that? But it's just so there's a part of it that seems so obvious to me, but I also realize that it is not obvious that it is not like this everywhere, that this is not how all people think. But I hope that by showing an example of, Hey, this can work and everyone can be friends and there really is not a need to feel threatened or be competing with other people

Samantha Winslow (47:41):
And even their desire to host, they feel comfortable to reach out, to be like, Hey, what are some of the things that you've noticed? So we don't need to reinvent the wheel. So reaching out to get some mentorship, reaching out to get some tips, and then we share that knowledge. This is all about sharing the community. It's great.

Kayla Dever (48:06):
And then we're able to collaborate in a way that is ultimately going to support our community better because guess what? It means more trials, right? It means that I can tell you, okay, this is what I'm thinking of hosting at these venues and these dates. It would be great if you could host this on this date and then it would compliment each other and that sort of stuff. That's only good. That's only good. More Nose. Work is only good.

Dianna L. Santos (48:30):
Well, again, I just want to tip my hat to both of you. You have done such an incredible thing for everyone in your community, but it has spread beyond there, and it is amazing what you both have accomplished. It is mind boggling the amount of work you both have undertaken over the last couple of years. Again, I just need to reiterate, these women work in the medical field, so we should already just be in awe of them, and they do this on top of it, and they train their own dogs, and they also do teaching classes, and it is just incredible. I don't know when you guys sleep, but it is so awe inspiring, which is why I wanted to talk to you both again about everything that you both do, because it is amazingly incredible what you're able to accomplish and how much you've given back and the gift that you've given to people and their dogs and the way you've been able to help them with their journey, regardless of the hat they may wear. That is a gift. So I really hope that you both just take a moment and be like, you know what? We're pretty awesome because you are. Thank you. Was there anything else that you wanted to share with our listeners as far as what your plans are going forward or anything else?

Kayla Dever (49:37):
No, I think just follow us on Facebook. I post pretty regularly on our Facebook page, which is every dog knows work. Our website has our trial schedule and seminars and stuff that we have coming up and maybe come to Michigan. It's a nice place. Come mentor trials,

Samantha Winslow (49:58):
Make a vacation out of it. There

Dianna L. Santos (49:59):
You go.

Kayla Dever (50:01):
It's a nice place. It's not hotter than Hades here all the time.

Dianna L. Santos (50:05):
There you go. Yes, especially right now where everyone is melting. Be like, Ooh, maybe Michigan sounds pretty good. Well, thank you guys so very much. This was a fantastic interview and I look forward to speaking to you both again soon.

Samantha Winslow (50:17):
Thank you, Dianna.

Dianna L. Santos (50:19):
I want to thank both Kayla and Samantha for all that they do as instructors and trial hosts, volunteer coordinators, and just people who are passionate about Nose Work, and dogs. Again, I've been extraordinarily privileged to host both of these very talented instructors for several of our webinars and set university. They are thoughtful, they are talented, and they're so empathetic. They really think about the entire team. They think about the dog. They think about the handler and the unit. I love the way that they're approaching how we can ensure that this whole nose where thing stays in the right lane, that we're focusing on the right things, that this is about having a good time with our dogs. So again, the fact that they're doing this on top of having full-time, medical career jobs, insane. So I really want to thank them very, very much for everything that they do.

(51:11):
And also taking some time to speak with me, not once, but twice, because this is our second follow-up interview. So I would be able to get this all out for you to definitely make certain to check them out on Every Dog Nose Work. We'll have information on how be able to connect to their website as well as their social media up on our replay page for this episode on our website, as well as our social media pages. But if you happen to know of another individual or business that is giving back to the sniffing community, please let me know. I want to talk to them. The more positivity that we can share, the better. But thank you also very much for listening. We really do appreciate it. Happy training, and we look forward to seeing you soon.